PhoenixFlare500
Diamond Membership
I like chocolate[ss:LostPeon's Gray][ss:LostPeon's Gray]
Posts: 896
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Post by PhoenixFlare500 on Sept 21, 2006 11:35:36 GMT -8
I'm not a fan of democrats or republicans. So... who is left to vote for in the US then?
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Post by technohawk on Sept 21, 2006 12:28:59 GMT -8
So... who is left to vote for in the US then? Ralph Nader? kidding. There's really not any worthy party to vote for in the US. Luckily, I'm a Canadian. Dems are fine to vote for if they have someone with charisma and moderate intelligence. They don't have anyone like that at the moment though. Al Gore, Hilary Clinton, Joe Liberman combined have half the charisma of Bill Clinton. Bush has charisma and an excellent campaign manager, which is why I suspect he won almost half the votes in the first election. He even legally won the second time with fear mongering. And to rabid, I consider my post an opinion, one of millions. Having a different opinion should NOT mean an inclination to fight. Because that theory that me wanting to start a fight is yet again something akin to how Bush thinks and what the christian-conservative movement seems to like. If you are different in any way, you are bad and are going to hell is the message they seem to get out in the public. ie If you are black, muslim, female, gay, democrat, independent, free thinking, immigrant, latino-- then you must convert into a white male republican, otherwise though shalt be smote upon the mountain top. Or if a mountain is not available, a really tall hill.
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Post by mortalcry on Sept 21, 2006 17:04:19 GMT -8
Christianity is NOT about racism, it is NOT about politics, and i do NOT see any proof that you are a christian. Christianity is based on the life of Jesus Christ and what He has done for ALL of us whether we are willing to accept Him or not, which is TOTALLY AGAINST LIBERALISTS VIEWS. The fact that you are diverting the attention of this topic towards democrats and republicans means that YOU are a liberal. Liberals want freedom from laws such as anti-abortion, freedom to kill people who need life support, regardless of those who care about them, amongst other tasteless things which i detest. Hence, hawk, you say smite me based on christianity, i have one question for you: do you believe in murder?
Therefore this is explained.....
Liberalism= ;D
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Post by dpgunit on Sept 21, 2006 18:02:31 GMT -8
Liberals are the people that tell people to give money to some other people that don't do shit, then when it comes their turn to pay they blame it on other people.
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dxlightning
Platinum Membership
[ss:LostPeon's Gray][ss:LostPeon's Gray]
Posts: 1,246
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Post by dxlightning on Sept 21, 2006 18:20:00 GMT -8
Classic conservative generalization. I prefer to think each Liberal is different, as each conservative is different. I myself don't like to label myself with a specific political belief, so I get to sit back and laugh at you all as you argue and throw worthless character attacks at each other.
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Post by rabidgecko on Sept 21, 2006 19:08:26 GMT -8
ok mortal, but going off to shoot the Iraq's is ok? I understand that in some circmstances the Church does acknowledge that war in inevitable, and needs to be fought. But what of all the civilians killed in this conflict? All the innocent lives that should not be wasted are going down the drain because of this religious war. That's all it is really, Saddam Hussein is gone, Osama is not in Iraq, all that remains are these "insurgents" and "rebels". They are fighting because 1. the west is trying to force on them governments and ways of life they don't all agree with, and two because of their religion (point taken on the fact that they see their religion in a radical way). So, fighting a war like this and all the innocent civilians killed are justified? Are they dying for the greater good? Your Christian government is behind all this? And you say Liberals are completely ANTI-Christian?
You better read what dx wrote, generalizations are bad. There is no way you can say liberals all don't care about abortion and the killing of unborn babies. When I take political tests, I am dropped under the liberal side of the spectrum, even though I am against abort, legalization of marijuana, and I agree that our Canadian troops should be in Afghanistan making sure the Taliban do not have the chance to take over that country again.
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Post by technohawk on Sept 21, 2006 19:38:15 GMT -8
Well to the conservative ignorant morons this one's for you.(Why sugar coat it anymore, aside from chalupa, most of you make absolutely moronic generalizations(i probably do as well, just not as much)
I will clearly state beliefs, thus proving myself not a liberal, and also, thankfully, NOT a conservative either. If you didn't have ADHD and read my whole long posts on this and other threads, you would already know these things.
1) I'm Pro-Life (not anti-abortion, there is a difference. George Bush Jr. is anti-abortion but pro-death penalty. I'm for all life that also means no executions, euthanasia, or wars killing innocent civilians)
2) I am NOT a christian. Yet I do believe in God. To further explain this to the tiny brains who can't comprehend that a non christian could believe in God-- I see God as a loving entity that is made of pure love and can only be pure love. Somehow our species detached from that love and we all ended up here in an attempt to figure out how to reconnect to God. Since this is not your average by the book way of thinking, go ahead call me a liberal. Conservatives use the word liberal as an insult, like it's something scary. It's not scary, it's called using your intelligence to think for yourself instead of hating or being apathetic to someone because your preacher tells you that God wants it that way.
3) I believe in Jesus and the good he has done. And mortal, you ignorant moron, liberals showing compassion and tolerance for others is far more christian than the general hatred shown by the Upity white male republicans.
There's a small sample of my beliefs, relevant to this "discussion."
Christianity IS about politics. Elections are won and lost based on getting the religious vote. Church and state are supposedly separate, yet how often do you here a campaigning politician in either party talk about their belief in God? Very often. Even if a politician doesn't believe in God, they would never(or rarely) admit it since that would hurt their campaign.
Christianity tries to act like it's not racists and occasionally suceeds in doing so. Yet it has a violent history of intollerance against other races and belief systems. Crusades anyone? They were attempts to control Jerusalem from the evil arabs and slaughter them in the name of Jesus. Somehow I don't think Jesus wanted that when he told people to "Love thy neighbor." Maybe christians just misinterpreted it as "Shove thy neighbor onto a shiny sword tip."
The christian churches have occasionally done good things. Possibly more good than bad. The leaders that make it onto TV however, seem to demonstrate that they are tyranical and bloodthirsty animals.
Do i believe in murder? No, I think it's wrong. But hey, mortal, let's ask some of your christian leaders.
Pat Robertson On the August 22, 2005 broadcast of The 700 Club, Robertson said of Venezuelan President Hugo Chávez, "I don't know about this doctrine of assassination, but if he thinks we're trying to assassinate him, I think that we really ought to go ahead and do it. It's a whole lot cheaper than starting a war, and I don’t think any oil shipments will stop."
Jerry Falwell on CNN “But you’ve got to kill the terrorists before the killing stops. And I’m for the president to chase them all over the world. If it takes 10 years, blow them away in the name of the Lord.”
I guess they think murder is ok, as long as it's in the name of the lord, and against people with differing opinions.
As to DPG's generalization perhaps for other liberals it's true. I donate a portion of my own money to charities as a personal choice. If you do too, good for you, you're helping out. If you don't that's fine too. I can only control my own actions.
And Mortal, you still didn't explain anything with that stupid animation. At least mine showing conservatives as bloodthirsty savages was clear.
Mortal, remember next time you wish to engage in a battle of wits, bring amunition. Chalupa always does.
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Post by mortalcry on Sept 22, 2006 14:26:56 GMT -8
Hawk, since I don't really care to go through 333 posts to find your views on politics and religion, i had to encourage you to rewrite them by prodding you a bit. Worked didn't it? Now that i find your biased opinion more set in concrete i am totally unclear of where you stand....your not a liberal, your not a conservative, your not a christian, then what do you stand for? Since you made the initial attack on everything i post except on NASCAR, and even that was sketchy..., I must defend. To make things clear to everyone, I am a christian, NOT a conservative, democratic, republican, OR liberal. I merely used a conservative tactic to expose hawk of his views. I will submit to the "authorities of man" when needed, however i do not trust anyone in politics or anyone who has FAITH in politics. Though most of you may not understand this, I have FAITH in Christ, the Son of GOD, not in man.
Here is my reply from hawk's post:
1) Life is good.
1)George Bush is forced to do certain things as a president, it is his job. Naturally, you, have to use him as an example of christianity because of his testimony, but then explaining christianity as George Bush. Bush is not christianity, Bush claims that he believes in christianity, but he also has his job to do which may mean getting his hands "dirty". Stop using him as an example. And since i don't trust media to be honest i cannot be sure of what is real in the war, the only people that can say anything about it would be the veterans.
I'm out of time, i will continue with edit later.........
2)What is the name, this god, you are refering to? Because if it is God, then would believe in His word which would come directly from the bible. You know, that book you might have looked at when you were in sunday school? Tell me something, what does SIN mean to you? Is it just merely a word, or does it remind you of the things of your past that you might feel bad about. If you read the bible and understand what it says then you would know that Jesus was sent here to redeem us of our SINS and give us LIFE so we can become CHILDREN of GOD. Or untill now, have you conveniently shoved that aside for your own cares?
3) The answering these few easy questions will enable me to go further, untill then...
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Post by rabidgecko on Sept 22, 2006 16:14:01 GMT -8
you dont trust in man? well what about that whole thing about man being made in god's image and Jesus, the son of God, being a human himself? odd view there mortal.
oh and your signature sounds like it came out of the crusades : P
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Post by technohawk on Sept 22, 2006 17:40:19 GMT -8
Better edit soon, you only get 500 minutes. And your "tactics" make me laugh. I have never had a need to hide my beliefs. You don't have to read 333 posts to understand that. Probably only 20-30 of the posts have concerned the political area. Getting me to state my beliefs wasn't by your prodding. It's by my unending desire to be understood clearly and to understand clearly. Now concerning christian leadership Did i not just show 2 examples of people OTHER than george bush saying stupid unchristian things in the name of christianity? Forget the 333 posts, just look up a few inches on your screen. Added note. I remember sunday school teaching me that God was inside each of us. He's inside us because he created us and loves us. To do anything harmful to anyone else(...the least of my brothers) is doing harm to God. Distrust of mankind is a distrust of God's creation. So by your own words you contradict yourself. You can't trust in God and NOT trust in what he creates. Just makes no sense. Bring ammo!
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Post by mortalcry on Sept 23, 2006 7:19:26 GMT -8
I have edited briefly in #2 in my previous post, feel free to answer to continue this discussion.
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Post by rabidgecko on Sept 23, 2006 7:45:47 GMT -8
I actually think techno knows what sins are, and I'd bet he lives a pretty good life (when counting sins) in comparision to the rest of the world
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Post by technohawk on Sept 23, 2006 10:38:48 GMT -8
Mortal, when I said bring ammo, I meant for you to bring ammo to use against me, not ammo for me to use against you.
1) You have NOT answered any of my questions in my posts. You just continue to ask questions.
2) I will still answer your questions.
3) My beliefs in this answer may by similar to yours in some aspects, but different in other. So you can disregard it all and call me a commie liberal pinko or whatever conservatives say to avoid opening their minds.
The Dubya question-asked and answered
so I guess it's on to SINS! Yay!
As Rabid guessed, I do my best to live a moral lifestyle. I Follow the laws of the land AND the laws of common decency. I'm far from perfect and make mistakes from time to time. When I do, I learn from them and continue on.
I know much about the word SIN and it's various meanings. I find that focusing on SIN tends to make people feel GUILTY and SHAMEFUL about their actions and forces them to live in a world of FEAR(I found the caps key too).
I prefer to focus on FORGIVENESS, you know, from the bible. Forgiveness wipes the slate clean, allowing anyone to stop feeling shamed about themselves and start feeling and doing good.
Have I Sinned? Hell yea! But I also atone for my wrong doings and get on with my life.
I also do NOT see the same things a conservative Christian sees as sin.
Homosexuality is not a sin in my opinion. Neither is being Heterosexual. Neither is being a liberal or other non-conservative type. (and to prevent another dumb post, I am a heterosexual)
I'd say state sanctioned deaths of inmates would be a sin as would abortion. Yet these too can be forgiven, as can all sins. Maybe they can never be fully understood, but still they can be forgiven.
Now onto God. The name I tend to use for God is..... GOD. Yet, it is just a name for a being so unique and powerful that a simple name doesn't help us understand God. And really, if I called God "The Universe", Great Spirit, or Fred it would not change who/what God really is. It would, I suspect, allow you to write me off as crazy(in only your opinion) if I used a non-Christian descriptive of God.
Now, one way or another, regardless of what you or I believe in, God will always be the same entity. God does not change, only our beliefs of what God is can change.
I used to believe in the Christian version of God. That only the Christian view of God was the correct one and that everyone else's view was wrong. I have changed my views on that.
My old view was also of a vengeful God that would send evil doers and "sinners" to a permanent agonizing Hell. My view on this has also changed.
My current view is that of a loving and forgiving God. A parent that is 100% understanding and non-judging of us. The type of parent that will let us screw up 1,000 times and still be patient and let us learn things for ourselves, even if it takes another 1,000(or near infinite) mistakes to learn a particular lesson.
Now I might as well go into my thoughts of Jesus' death now, even though it may make this post so long that you may have to read it in sections.
Or you can do what you have before and skip parts of it and make uninformed posts replying to it. (If you do that you probably won't be reading this part anyways)
I do believe that Jesus showed humanity the greatest way to live your life: With total love and understanding about everything and everyone.
I do believe that Jesus created a path to heaven. However, I don't believe the method in the traditional Christian view.
I don't believe that it was Jesus' death that showed us the way to heaven.
I see it as Jesus' LIFE that showed us the way to heaven.
If Jesus' sole function was to sacrifice himself to save the world then he could have been killed when he was a baby and had the same effect.
But he didn't die as a child and instead lived long enough to teach people many lessons on how to live a better life.
It was the teachings that lead to salvation. It was also because those teachings that Jesus was crucified(since some people didn't care to hear about love and forgiveness.
Now my view on Jesus would have caused me to be burned at the stake had I lived anytime during the first 1000 or so years of Christianity's formation.
Luckily I live here in the 21st century, where I only have to worry about my heathen country of Canada being invaded by the USA.(Joking, well maybe)
Now how about mortal telling me some of your beliefs(ie show some spine) and do it clearly and concisely with a minimum of rhetoric(ie show some intelligence) and demonstrate you read the whole post(ie show some literacy).
And I am quite aware that I need to work on being more tolerant of Chrisitans.
Forgive me.
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Post by Chalupa! on Sept 23, 2006 12:09:19 GMT -8
How the heck did you guys turn a thread about being a Liberal into another religious debate?
Talk about generalizations, and then label all conservatives as Christians and the same with the current government.....
Just because Christians tend to be conservative does not mean that you can throw religion as the basis for being a conservative. That's about as stupid as showing statistics that Blacks vote to the left, so the Democratic party are the black liberals. Heck, most convicts are democrats so is it the criminal party?
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Post by technohawk on Sept 23, 2006 13:16:24 GMT -8
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