WEll. there u have it. 33 dead and 15 injured

[Prone]

Alright, I'll take a stand here.

Eric Harris & Dylan Klebold, and Cho Seung-Hui all had mental problems, we know that. It's just that, what brought them to this utter tragedy?

You know, in life, there are good things, and there are bad things. When applied to us, they can either lead to a good life, or a life destined for failure. In the case of our three murderers, they were apparently abused at one point (either mentally or physically) in their life, and they endured enough pain throughout life, that it just exploded. Sudden, without warning.

Hui's apparent mental instability was seen by everyone, througout his life. one and a half years before the shooting, Lucinda Roy, the former chairwoman of Virginia Tech's english department, said that his frequent anger led her to the decision that he should be taught alone.

What's even more interesting, is how he got the guns.

Virginia Tech Shooting

Cho paid $571 for a 9 mm Glock 19 pistol just over a month ago, the owner of Roanoke Firearms told CNN Tuesday. He also used a .22-caliber Walther pistol in the attack, police said.

John Markell said Cho was very low-key when he purchased the Glock and 50 rounds of ammunition with a credit card in an "unremarkable" purchase.

Cho presented three forms of identification and did not say why he wanted the gun, Markell said.

State police conducted an instant background check that probably took about a minute, the store owner said.

Now, that's a pretty quick background check if you ask me. Well, he never said what the guns were for, which would make anyone suspicious, which they weren't. He went in "low-key", apparently showing that he was greiving, because of something.

Well, I'm out....Continue the chatter.

[dxlightning]

Prone, low-key means he was unsuspicious, and most likely seemed like a kid who had just moved into a new house and felt he needed protection to the shop owner. Low-key does not mean depressed.

Besides, telling the shop owner what you're going to use the gun for isn't required when purchasing a firearm, so there's no reason why that would be suspicious. Yes, the kid seemed like he was insane, but never this violently insane. This was the kind of kid who most would assume would simply have a mental breakdown and spend his life in the corner of a padded room, not a murderer.

[G0DESS]

Gosh, I have been so consumed in my own little meaningless world that I haven't really been in tune with this whole VT tragedy. God Bless the families that are suffering such a horrible tragedy and may they find peace in their heats for their loss ...My heart goes out to them.

Here is part of an article I just read on MSNBC:

NBC, MSNBC and news services
Updated: 13 minutes ago 4/19/2007

BLACKSBURG, Va. - High school classmates say gunman was bullied

Long before he killed 32 people in the worst mass shooting in U.S. history, Cho Seung-Hui was bullied by fellow high school students who mocked his shyness and the strange way he talked, former classmates said.



I think Techno is right. I agree with the bullying part. I think that in a lot of cases it is a person with very low self esteem that probably goes trough life getting bullied by either classmates, peers, co-workers, etc. They finally just decide one day that they've had enough, and lose it... It's actually really sad because we don't always see the signs and a lot of times there is help out there but we're so dang quick to judge people and not lend a helping hand...It's too bad.

I think by now, you all know how I feel about bullying. Bullying is serius stuff and I am so, so, so strongly against it. I was bullied as a young girl and it is such an awful feeling. I think that unless you've experienced it, you really have no idea how hurtful it truly is . I remember feeling so lonely, I wanted to just die. I actually tried to commit suicide at the age of 13. That's another book but you get the idea..

Anyway, hopefully this tragedy will help us learn to look for signs so that in the future maybe, just maybe we can help save even just one life...

-G

[mephistool]

I have to comment first and say on a couple of posts, this thread quickly turned to a debate about iraq and bush. wtf?

But to stick to the topic, RIP to all that died. I have a cousin who goes to VT but he was sick that day so he missed class.. Kinda scary. Someone was killed and the guy committed suicide at the UW campus a week or two ago. So many campus shootings going on lately.

[softspoken]

Hahha i know, guilty, I was part of that debate.

G, I just have to say, I am with you on the bullying subject. It's disgusting and unnecessary. I was also bullied when I was younger, and gawd, I f**king hated it. I also agree that if somebody hasn't experienced it themselves, they most definately don't know the extent it goes to and what it actually feels like.

I think it's a big thing, people ignore and don't take seriously. I think if people were more considerate, we wouldn't have desperate people going off their rockers.

[tranceeagle]

I think from the perspective of a bullied person using a gun can sometimes make sense and that's one reason things like this happen.

The bullied person might be physically weaker than the bullies(or weaker in some aspect. So to them the only way to become stronger is to get a gun.

Instantly they are the stronger person and can have their bullies at their mercy. And from that mindset they don't even see themselves as being the bad guy, but instead as some sort of super hero killing the evil villains.


And in many cases it just remains a fantasy scenario. But in these instances it becomes far too real.

[Prone]

Since G gave a little description of her life, I'll share a little bit of my parent's

I utterly hate abuse, and I've never had the experience myself, but I am very lucky to have the parents that I do. My mom moved occasionally, when her mother felt like it. She was yelled at, mentally abused, and tortured inside. Her mother drank a lot. Re-married twice, and now is divorced. Both men that my grandma married just hurtled insults every way they came at. Yet through it all, my mom got counseling, becaue an adventist, and here I am.

My father's life was much different. He never had the abuse my mom had. He was an adventist all the time

I've actually been bullied, at 12 years old, just on campus walking around. I've also been bullied In elementary school as well. That is a completely different story though.


Back to the topic at hand.

Did you hear that 9 more were in critical condition, and that they might not make it? I heard that from some collegues at school. We had a little debate about it. It got pretty interesting after awhile.

The gunman just went insane, and knew of only one thing that would get America's attention. revenge. Nothing else would have been better, because in his mind, "you have had a billion chances to prevent this from happening." It's just sad that he ended up doing what he did.

Bulliness can be attributed to mental abuse as well, because you remember it, even through your life. It's the same fashion. You get the same effects.

The most prevailing problem with bullied kids is this common denominator: they will, sooner or later, show how they really feel inside. They feel like showing who's boss. No, it's not jealousy over who's better than who, It's about taking revenge for everything that went wrong. It's about making an attempt at showing yourself that you are better.

The sad truth is that this problem can't really be resolved very easily.

[softspoken]

People need to straighten out, that's all.
What the hell is the point of bullying. I don't believe a SINGLE person who says they have never contributed to some sort of bullying, whether it was standing behind the person saying/diong the shit (aka in the group) or doing it first hand themselves. Not to mention, I can't stand it when people are just bystanders. Just seriously, get over yourself and do what the hell is right.

Um Prone, I don't wanna be a jackass, but.. how does knowing your mom was abused ("lucky" I believe was the term) throughout her childhood give you a piece of that? You never FELT the pain and angst. Words, well they can only tell you so much, you never feel things like that through words. Believe me. And only can one who has felt such, explain such - and only those who have felt some sort of traumatic experience can actually relate on some level. Sure, I could understand say if your dad beat your mom in FRONT of you, then yeah that's something you felt. But, you didn't, and he doesn't. Be happy, don't try to find a connection to pain when it hasn't hit you because it's nothing to gloat about. (not that you were gloating, b ut hopefully you understand my meaning)

Anyway, this kid was off his rocker. Seriously, what kind of sane person takes bullying directed at themsleves to such lengths. He obviously had some sort of underlying mental disorder lingering about to have caused his pain to find such payback. It was an act of desperate measures. I mean, there's no doubt in my mind that he felt a lot of hurt and suffering, but it's obvious that he wasn't a "big" person, in the sense that he couldn't let it go... perhaps obsessive, most defs. He must have had a lot of constant batters as a song would be on repeat. Anyway point being, he was treated unjustly no doubt, but his solution came from a dark place of, well, insanity. He wasn't stable. Whether it's one or the other (bullying/mental illness), I can't really say, none of us can since we didn't know him. But I say it's highly likely something developed from one another, branching into each other.

In any case, it's a sad ending for those who were innocent and had their lives stolen from someone who wanted to inflict pain the way he felt it.

Rest in Peace.

[porsche944s]

I like how some of you Cannucks are baggin' on us because guns aren't illegal...in order for that to be the case it would take more than the Congress. It would require the "yes" vote of approximately 180,000,000 people. I personally think that people calling for the abolition of firearms should be shot, for their lack of reasoning or a twist of irony if nothing else.

For about 30 years the US had a ban in effect on automatic weapons; it expired sometime last year and the sale of AK-47s, AR-15s and related weapons was legal for some time. As far as I know, the ban was renewed, making the purchasing and owning of those weapons illegal again. If he wasn't dead, and hadn't killed all those people, Cho would still be in jail for possession of an illegal firearm.

As for you people talking about people blowing themselves up, that's because they have lost sight of the religion they believe they are supporting. They advocate "holy war" to protect a religion that is in no danger whatsoever. This is a violation of their own law. According to that same law, instead of killing their peers, should be killed in turn.

As for the issue of drugs, people who use illegal substances to give themselves a "high" to escape reality for whatever reason obviously haven't matured beyond childhood. Tell a child not to do something and they still do it anyways. Only a grown adult knows if something is bad for them or not. I have some solutions for drug use: make the use of narcotics and cannibus a capital crime, and firebombing Colombia.

Now that I'm way off topic, you freaking Canadians need to stop talking trash about the US. Besides, aren't you guys still owned by a little old lady on an island?




Governmental debate = all the more reason to support CZAR_RBOB.


[Agent:2]

[tranceeagle]

Let's see the numbers
1) This is mostly offtopic
2) The automatic weapon ban was in effect from 1994 to 2004 and was not renewed. Authorization for the renewal of the ban is ongoing.
3) The only drugs involved in this incident were legal anti-depressants
4) Don't needlessly blame people from other countries.
[Agent:2]

[Dr.Klitschko]

1. Ban of automatic weapons should be renewed.
2. This guy was an american right? Nevertheless he put his originating country South Korea in discredit. My best friend is a korean and i seriously do not want to talk with him about this incident because this guy wasnt a real korean. He lived in a not korean environment most of his life.


[Agent:2]

[tyrantisius]

So that means he's not a real korean? Even if he "isn't", why wouldn't you be able to talk to a real korean about it? Are you THAT racist?

[rabidgecko]

p.s. people who aren't canadian can't call a canadian a canuck... that's not right.

don't do it.

[dxlightning]

...and we already went over the fact that Pierre Trudeau ended Britain's rule over Canada over 10 years ago. We've mentioned it at least twice, both in threads that Porsche posted in.

[♦Whot♦]

Porsche, I think you should take world issues and current events instead of history. Or at least be a minor in logical arguements.