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Post by trashbag on Jan 14, 2005 3:53:48 GMT -8
hmm
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Post by Chalupa! on Jan 14, 2005 7:56:03 GMT -8
Trash, I didn't know you liked Fiction!!?? There you guys go again, believing everything you see and hear. Did you also notice how wonderful a place Iraq was in the movie? Believe that too?
Chalupa
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Post by rabidgecko on Jan 14, 2005 15:51:35 GMT -8
I'm sorry to kinda turn your own comment on you Chalupa, but if you think we shoudlnt believe everything we see and hear, then why should we believe what you are trying to convince us about Bush? It's just a point that I thought was blatantly obvious.
SO you can't really make us believe what you say after what you just posted.
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Post by Chalupa! on Jan 14, 2005 16:39:46 GMT -8
I didn't say don't believe anything you read or hear did I? Ouch, burned you again. (Your too easy, can we get some more advanced debater's please?).
What I said, was not to believe everything and you still shouldn't. In fact, don't just take everything I say. Do some research and check the facts. If you did, you would have found very quickly that the IQ article was a big hoax. That was the point I was making. I'm asking you to use some common sense (which liberals seem to lack) when you draw your conclusions.
So far, you have made two posts in a row that were actually false.
Next!
Chalupa
BTW, just for sh*ts and grins, tell us about this missle defense system you posted about earlier that Bush created? I got to hear this one. ;D
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Post by rabidgecko on Jan 14, 2005 17:32:45 GMT -8
Well by the context of your post it seemed fairly evident that you implied in some form or another that we should not believe everything that we see and/or hear!
plus about your post saying that the IQ survey was a hoax, I'm yet to believe that until you SHOW me the evidence that it truly was a hoax! I swear that I would show you the evidence that it is not a hoax and a rightful survey in its own accord but seeing as I saw it relatively long ago, you should not assume that I can remember where my mother had found this survey.
And are you calling me a liberal?
Also as for your asking for more advanced debaters I find that a rather rude insult to my intelligence.
In which manner was my first post false? I fail to see it in everyway I try. Just because there is something in that post that you may disagree with does in no way shape or form make it a FALSE post. A false post would include such things as Openly stating that the world is flat persay.
BTW to stop you from trying to work me like a slave I suggest that you yourself look up that information on the missle sheild if you are so very keen on acquiring some sh*ts and grins. No joke, that is quite a true thing! If you seem to know so very much then I thought you would surely have heard of that program.
p.s. I wouldn't think that a man like yourself should take much pride in believing that he had overwhelmed an other person much younger than themselves. I mean the idea i suppose is to make a 4 year old race against a healthy and athletic 19 year old. But anybody who considered that a remotely fair race should not be allowed to leave the house alone.
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Post by Chalupa! on Jan 14, 2005 18:14:21 GMT -8
Well by the context of your post it seemed fairly evident that you implied in some form or another that we should not believe everything that we see and/or hear! Once again, I said everything. Don't believe it all, some of it is fake. Do your research first, and make sure the information is true. plus about your post saying that the IQ survey was a hoax, I'm yet to believe that until you SHOW me the evidence that it truly was a hoax! I swear that I would show you the evidence that it is not a hoax and a rightful survey in its own accord but seeing as I saw it relatively long ago, you should not assume that I can remember where my mother had found this survey. Wow, i'm surprised you put your foot in your mouth again! lol- and the same foot! But here we go kids! ... www.isteve.com/IQhoax.htmsq.4mg.com/IQstates.htmand the final proof! The retraction from the guy who started it, admitting it was a hoax after the issue blew up in his face! americanassembler.com/features/iq_state_averages.htm - and this is an anti-bush, liberal news group!!In case you want to see how long this same prank has been used: And are you calling me a liberal? If it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck..... well, Yes I am! Also as for your asking for more advanced debaters I find that a rather rude insult to my intelligence. Sorry, but you have to admit, you were pretty bad. In which manner was my first post false? I fail to see it in everyway I try. Just because there is something in that post that you may disagree with does in no way shape or form make it a FALSE post. A false post would include such things as Openly stating that the world is flat persay. This is where you look so bad, and I have to call you a bad debater! See, it's not an opinion, but false information!! You fell for a hoax without doing any research. Had you looked this up, or ran a google search, you would have found that this was a hoax. You might as well have called the world flat and then said it was your opinion. You would still be wrong! BTW to stop you from trying to work me like a slave I suggest that you yourself look up that information on the missle sheild if you are so very keen on acquiring some sh*ts and grins. No joke, that is quite a true thing! If you seem to know so very much then I thought you would surely have heard of that program. Let me get this straight. You make a claim with no facts at all (This after making a false claim that I have proven false over and over). Now, you want ME to look it up? In a debate, you make a claim, and YOU back it up. Want to learn? Read my earlier claims, and how I post links to support my position. I'll take this as your way of saying you were wrong again. p.s. I wouldn't think that a man like yourself should take much pride in believing that he had overwhelmed an other person much younger than themselves. I mean the idea i suppose is to make a 4 year old race against a healthy and athletic 19 year old. But anybody who considered that a remotely fair race should not be allowed to leave the house alone. Actually, I feel sorta bad for beating you. But your analogy on the race is a bit off. A more accurate one would be, you jump in on a game of basketball with some older players, and then complain when you lose. I agree it's not fair, and i'm trying to teach you as we go here. Obviously, you didn't listen because you made the same mistake twice. Look at Trash who is good in debate (even though we sometimes disagree). She never made the same mistake twice. Her and I have had some excellent exchanges. But when one of us is burned, we don't come back with the same info. Chalupa Oh and since you said you would back up your IQ story...Let's see the facts! Put together a case that beats mine against it. There is a ton more proof that it was a hoax, but let's see what you got! (Or if your silly enough to put your foot in your mouth a third time!)
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Post by jjchong on Jan 15, 2005 0:04:04 GMT -8
That is true with each presidential nomination. So why doesn't this happen with every president? He is also the first President to win the majority in a long time. (Clinton did not win the majority vote). Let's at least be accurate! Chalupa Chalupa: Here are some counterbalancing stats: -Although Bush did win a majority, this is not uncommon when there are only 2 candidates. Yes—there were pesky Nader and others who took a whopping 1% of the votes…compare previous years when 3rd party turnout was 3%, 10%, and even 20% 1. Harder to get a bigger piece of pie when it’s being shared by more people. Also, in case you cared: -lowest margin of victory for a republican incumbent president this century 2-lowest or second lowest margin of victory for an incumbent wartime president, or any incumbent president since wilson 1. These numbers all deal, of course, with the percent of the vote Bush got, as opposed to the raw number, which was higher this year not only because of the usual population growth (More ppl also voted for Kerry than any other previous candidate! 3), but because of record voter turnout 4. 1 en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S._presidential_election 2 hnn.us/roundup/entries/9243.html3 www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A41006-2004Nov10.html4 www.fairvote.org/reports/CSAE2004electionreport.pdfAs for Kerry's flip-flops? Here's some of Bush: www.democrats.org/specialreports/top10_flipflops/. My opinion on the matter is that it's tough to maintain one line when you're in politics for 10 (bush) or 20 (kerry) years... (btw, you claimed Bush had a higher IQ than Gore. The results, though ambiguous, say otherwise: www.vdare.com/sailer/kerry_iq_lower.htmThe IQ hoax seems to have prompted a real data response taken from elementary test scores sq.4mg.com/stateIQ-income.htm, sq.4mg.com/Racevoting.htmFinally some easily found links on Fahrenheit 911: www.michaelmoore.com/warroom/f911notes/www.davekopel.com/Terror/Fiftysix-Deceits-in-Fahrenheit-911.htmpeace all. (well...someday, hopefully)
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Post by Chalupa! on Jan 15, 2005 1:07:03 GMT -8
Chalupa: Here are some counterbalancing stats: -Although Bush did win a majority, this is not uncommon when there are only 2 candidates. Yes—there were pesky Nader and others who took a whopping 1% of the votes…compare previous years when 3rd party turnout was 3%, 10%, and even 20% 1. Harder to get a bigger piece of pie when it’s being shared by more people. I was simply responding to Trash_Bag when she said that Bush won only a marginal victory. We can slice and dice the stats all day long, but you can't change the fact that : 1. More people voted for Bush than for Kerry 2. More people voted for Bush than any other president in history I understand that the running Independent at the time Clinton ran took alot of the votes, but it doesn't change my defending that you can't down play Bush's win. True, but if you compare the "flip flops" it's like comparing apples to oranges. Someone saying they don't think we need a committee, but agreeing to have one in compromise is hardly a flip flop. Kerry clearly talked out of both sides of his mouth. I'm not sure how you can compare those two lists. That's what the writer suggests, however it's a far cry either way from Liberals here calling Bush stupid.... Would you agree? I don't read much fiction. I could start a whole thread on Moore. You think he helped the Democrats? Look, the bottom line here is that not only did the US citizens clearly vote Bush another 4 years, they also supported very clearly the Republican party and it's values. www.pbs.org/newshour/extra/features/july-dec02/results.htmlIt was a huge victory night for the Republicans picking up seats in both houses. The last president whose party gained seats in both houses of Congress in a midterm election was Democrat Franklin D. Roosevelt, 68 years ago. The American people have spoken. Those that are sore losers can make up pretend stories all they want, but it won't change the fact that our Country is being ran by Republicans - Because that's what America wanted and Voted for. If you don't love democracy, then move! Chalupa
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Post by trashbag on Jan 15, 2005 9:05:35 GMT -8
hmm
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Post by Chalupa! on Jan 15, 2005 10:41:46 GMT -8
Trash, you bring up some good points about the life in Iraq. In fact, I think you should check out this web site. I must warn, it has some pictures that are too shocking for the local networks, but I think everyone should take a look at what is going on in Iraq that they (the media) doesn't want you to see! www.aim.org/static/2194_0_7_0_CI'm sure you have not seen pitures like this!!! I actually think Fahrenhype911 was a good movie. Hey, it's only fair to watch both sides! In fact, here is a link that points out the many, many lies and distortions of Michael Moores fictional movie: www.davekopel.com/Terror/Fiftysix-Deceits-in-Fahrenheit-911.htmAt least take a look at the trailer here: www.fahrenhype911.com/trailer.php?PHPSESSID=9c8b57bb9956fe995517fe464e3773caWhich really doesn't show much, so I recommend seeing the video. You might be surprised! And Trash, I am very aware of our missle defense or (Star Wars) program. I wish Bush could take all the credit, but we have been working on it since Reagan. My question to Rabid was to give some facts about this system he said "Bush started". I have yet to see which Missle Defense system "Bush started". I think the missle defense system is a great idea BTW and I doubt many of you that are Americans here would be against such a system to protect us. Why would you be? Are you against locks on your doors? Chalupa
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Post by trashbag on Jan 15, 2005 10:59:49 GMT -8
hmm
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Post by rabidgecko on Jan 15, 2005 17:36:47 GMT -8
i fold. as a poker player would say. I don't care what you say Chalupa, you won't ever change my mind about Bush. I don't fabriciate false stories about Bush. I did not say that the IQ survey was correct. I did not make up a fantasy story about missle defense systems. I have been taught most of the things I think about Bush in my school, and if you think that my school is wrong, well then there ain't much you can do. Maybe things as you see them work for you in America. That is fine with me. But I live in Canada and perhaps we just have to see things on a different angle, even if it will draw quite fierce criticism. So you can go on and say whatever you want, but I'll let you know that you have not swayed my opinion in any way. Think me a fool for that if you wish, but I don't care what you think. So yea, take over for me trash rabid_geck o
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Post by sweetnsexy on Jan 16, 2005 2:01:00 GMT -8
ok first i see alot of people talking about the votes. that doesnt matter. getting back to the point, im tired of everyone saying that bush is only after oil in iraq. this is not the case. why are our gas prices higher than ever? simple its not controled by us. the plain and simple reason i believe that we went to war in the first place is that sadaam was a power blinded mad man ( a sad reality that comes to most dictators). he treated his people wrongly, and violated rules set forth by the UN. we went in under the presumtion that he had weapons of mass destruction, but while we found none, we did find components used delivery systems. we found missles with a range of 500 miles, when it was laid out by the UN that sadaam was supposed to have nothing with a range greater than 99 miles. so the basis of people saying we went in just for the oil is wrong. anyways, the middle east has been for a long time (centuries) a place where people go to war over religous beliefs, and the thought that they are right and no one else is. now in modern day the world (for the majority) has become civilized, and the middle east remains as it always was. its time for the middle east to stop acting like a bunch of kid bully's and follow suit. terrorism on countries like the US must stop. and i believe that iraq is the example that needs to be made. if we can successfully turn iraq into a democratic country where ideas are shared openly and the majority rules goes into effect, maybe others will follow suit. sadly though i fear this is a war we cannot win.
i believe that the person to lead that is bush. to me he is a moral leader, and a good role model. while alot that he does is critisized you have to keep in mind that is only because of political lines. democrats are hard set on tipping the balance of power. i actually know bush personally as i went to church with him when he lived in midland texas. i can tell you that he is a good man. family oriented, and good role model with a strong moral concious. also he is very religous. i once saw him (at a party when he was elected governer of texas) ignore what was going on entirely just to talk to a young man who was an "athiest". by the end of the night the boy had cried his eyes out and accepted a faith. bush however did not press his own faith on the boy, but rather just wanted the boy to believe in something. that i find admireable. anyways back to the point once again. we for sure will not win the war against terrorism if we do not stand united against it. views have become to split... just let me ask any american this... do you remember 9-11? i know i do... my whole life changed that day.
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Post by Chalupa! on Jan 16, 2005 11:43:01 GMT -8
I just saw Michael Moore's 911 farenheit. I didnt realise that the Saudi Arabians own approximately 5% of the USA and that the Bush family and the Saudis had such tight financial ties. Also, the Bin Laden's contributions to the Bush campaign through the funding of that oil company where George W was a member of the board. It's a blatant lie! I'm confident Trash that if you watch Fahrenhype 911 you will post back here that you changed your mind about this and several other things you saw in this horrible movie. They don't even own 5% of all "foreign" investments, let alone of all the us!!! For instance, did you know that many people that were in his movie didn't want to be? That these were clips he "stole" and not created by Mr. Moore? That these people were taken out of context? That these people appear in Fahrenhype 911 saying they felt violated by being in this movie? Remember the guy with one false arm, and missing the other arm Trash? Remember him talking about how the pain felt? Would you be surprised that he was outraged at being taken out of context and that he never met Michael Moore, and he was filming an interview with someone who wanted to know how the pain felt when he didn't take his medication? That he supports the war? You will see him, and many others step up and talk about being taken out of context and that Michael Moore "stole" these clips for his own use. They are outraged, and you should be too! Seriously, you owe it to yourself to watch this movie. I know the kind of person you are and I think your curiosity will make you watch it. After you watch it, i'm interested in your thoughts. I think this movie might even change your mind about thinking the war was about oil. I have always known it wasn't but I think this may help some of you that have fallen victim to this "left wing conspiracy". Okay, and on to Rabid_Gecko: I never wanted, nor thought I could ever change your mind. If you hate Bush because you are against his beliefs, policies, etc., then I think that's great. We all have opinions. But when I see you post things that are flat out lies, then I have to point out the truth. Ever heard US slang, "Don't lie to kick it?". I always did wonder though why Liberals find the need to lie when pointing out how they don't like someone. Is it because they know most people don't think like they do, so lying about the person makes them feel better? Plus, you are not even a US citizen, nor are you old enough to vote...so I have no reason to change your mind. It doesn't matter to me who you like cause you will not be voting! Anyways (as LostPeon would say).... I have a question for those of you against this war: What do you think about the children's prisons we found in Iraq, with 5 year olds, 7 year olds? What do you think of the mass graves we found where the figure is expected to reach 1 million? What do you think of the torture chambers we found? This is for those that say Iraq is not a better place today. (Aimed at Trash) Also, don't you think anyone could take the daily murders, rapes, assaults, drive by shootings, gang wars, drug dealing, etc. that go on in this Country, and make it sound like "all hell has broken loose"? If that was all you heard in the news and you didn't live here, it would sound like a horrible place. But it's not! Get the point? Chalupa Oh, and I can't believe there is someone else here on my side!!! Finally! whew! Oh, and my favorite quote? "There is no terrorist threat" - Michael Moore
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Post by barneypwnz on Jan 16, 2005 13:50:04 GMT -8
Don't worry Rabid- I respect everyones opinion. Although I hate to be the one to break this to you, but you, and your mom fell for a big hoax. In fact, I laughed for the first few minutes at your post before I got myself together. There is obviously no IQ stats by state. Ooooo! Rabid got BURNED! Hehe... I wish I knew about this thread sooner I would have been glad to post some STufF. I have always noticed that people whom are Liberal, believe everything they hear, read, or think up, as long as it fits their agenda. Liberals are also known to lie, cheat, falsify, etc. anything they have to do. Take for instance the infamous CBS document scandal where false documents were placed on 60 minutes in order to make Bush look bad and help Kerry in the election. That's why I pointed out earlier the Liberals that talk about wanting Bush dead (never heard that about Clinton from conservatives). Unfortunately Chalupa, all polititians desparately try to dig up dirt about their opponent. Whether it's true or not, it's happened to every runner person. Swiftvets, for example. Need I say more? But I see what you're saying. I never knew it but I guess that there were flase documents on CBS hurting Bush, as you said. The biggest problem in any country (I mean a Republic or Democracy, not a monarchy or any of the sort), or at least one of the biggest, is always politics. Every politician is phony. No question about it. I guess that's why I always laugh at people who actually harass or vandalize or make fun of people's political points of views. Kind of like religion too. I won't start that, since it's a political debate thread, but yeah, I feel the same way about people who kill and such based on people's beliefs. I don't know what more to say. I'm tired also. Barney Edit: Hahahahahaa!! I took a looong time to write this, I was in and out writing it for about an hour and a half or so. Ignore all I said. This is kind of out dated. I didn't know that so many people would reply while I was writing this
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